A Dom/sub conversation about negotiating power exchange with the most traditional Dom I know …
the sub:
When I first came up with the idea of writing a blog post I wanted to call, “How to Train Your Dominant,” I thought it was a cute tongue-in-cheek way to get attention and a click. After all, everyone in the BDSM world knows it’s the Dominant’s job to “train’ the sub in how to please the Dom because, of course, the Dom is the one who must be pleased. But as I started writing, I realized how important it felt to me to get across the idea that building a dynamic between Dom and sub should be a collaboration between both sides, and that the submissive’s input is just as important as the Dom’s. Yet, my smart-ass title could make it sound as if I believe a sub really can train a Dominant and might provoke more eye-rolls than clicks. I would love to know your thoughts on the concept of a sub “training” her Dom, but more importantly, how a submissive might best work with his or her Dominant to create a D/s dynamic that works for both sides of the slash.
the Dom:
I’m not sure I agree with the premise of the book, what with the title alone invoking cognitive dissonance.
the sub:
I laughed when I read that, not because I am surprised that you disagree with the premise, but I am surprised that you disagreed with such brevity. Is that a sign that the premise is so farfetched to you that it is not even worth discussing? Or perhaps it is the word “train” that causes you this dissonance? If we exchanged that word for “collaboration” between submissive and Dominant, would that make it more likely to elicit your opinion?
Just this morning, I heard a podcast featuring a Dominatrix talking to a sub, who pointed out that “because the mind is the main organ of kinky play, BDSM is about 80% psychology.” She added, that “If your Dom doesn’t understand your personal submissive psychology, you’re going to have a hard time being submissive with that person, or letting go, let alone get turned on.” Of course, I’m sure a Dominant of your caliber knows this, and that you know exactly how to get a submissive to conspire with you to make her putty in your hands. But what if a submissive doesn’t have a Dom experienced enough to know such things? Is it not the submissive’s job to help him or her learn?
the Dom:
The word ‘train’ did have something of an effect. I look at it from the Dom’s POV (what else?). I have never believed that the sub had to be seriously trained — that is, had to be broken down to their ‘core self of nothing’ to be built back up to the vision the Dom wishes to see when he looks at her. I know some Doms revel in that. But I do not wish to have the sub be a full time dependent micromanaged child looking up at me with adoring eyes and asking permission to pee or softly reminding me that I told her to insert a buttplug three days ago and forgot to tell her she could remove it. Ouch.
Power exchange is very much about psychology and leveraging the sub’s submissive nature, or else attempting to create a submissive nature when it doesn’t exist, something more difficult. I do believe subs must ask for what they need. This is very basic for me, I express it early. But the sub’s approach needs to be subtle so as not to bruise my widdle ego. Just kidding — I have a fucking massive Dom ego. But just because the sub asks does not mean I will agree; although, unless it’s something totally outside my comfort zone, I will give it some consideration. But that does not quite fit the mold for the definition of ‘training’ the Dom.
I like a dynamic where both Dom and sub, after a period of negotiation and acclimation, are pleased with each other and relaxed, so that I don’t have to be constantly on alert for breaking of protocol. I preach the mantra of “Listen. Obey. Feel.” But every once in a while, I will do or threaten something evil that frightens the sub a little so she doesn’t get too complacent.
I consider myself fortunate that my very first sub was the textbook definition of an experienced and submissively minded D/s participant. I did not try to bluster my way through; instead, I admitted that I was inexperienced and would no doubt make some mistakes and asked her for patience and occasional gentle guidance. In that way, I could say she trained me to be an initially passable Dom. We were together almost two years, and I learned a lot from her. To this day, I am grateful to her.
I was also doing a ton of reading about BDSM and D/s at the time to try to catch up, and quickly came to understand what ‘topping from the bottom’ meant. I had to walk that fine line as a newbie between being the Dom and not allowing it, and yet needing to have some direction. So there was quite a bit of push-pull and ‘training’ going on then.
the sub:
Interesting. It seems to me that it’s not the idea of a sub training a Dom that causes you the dissonant effect, but the concept of training itself (in either direction). Your description of D/s partners going through a period of negotiation and acclimation sounds organic and definitely more relaxed than formalized training procedures. When I was first starting, it definitely would have been good for me to feel more relaxed about the process of figuring out my submissive self, but my husband and I were both new to it, and probably overly concerned with doing it “right.” We weren’t ready to join a community yet, and with no role models to show us how it’s done, we had little guidance but what we could find online or in books. And those books often heavily pushed the “training” idea. Of course, I am pushing it now myself! Although, like you, I think of it more in terms of a collaborative learning about each other than actual training in the literal sense.
Sounds like you read quite a bit, too, and were not too cocky to make use of some guidance from a submissive. From what I know of you, I’m sure you took to domination like a duck to water, but I think a lot of those new to Domming might be a little hesitant to throw off their cultural conditioning for equality of power. It was a huge challenge for my husband anyway. I read a line once in a submissive training guide that really resonated with me, and actually spurred me to write about this: “The biggest challenge is not getting the sub trained, it’s getting the Dom to step into his power, to feel it, exercise it, use it.”
So, I’m curious about the “occasional gentle guidance” your first sub offered you. Do you remember anything particularly helpful?
the Dom:
I remember almost everything the first sub showed me, despite it being about 15 years ago. While I did mostly take to Dominance ‘like a duck to water’, I also had to shake off some cultural conditioning. My father was adamant about “There’s never ANY reason to hit a woman ever!” and I had to be coaxed through my first intense spanking of the sub.
She was excellent at pointing out that I was a natural Dominant, she knew it five minutes after we met, and I just had to state clearly what I wanted. And she had this way of softly asking “Wouldn’t you like to have your way with me now, Sir?” That, just as designed, lit my brain on fire. I didn’t know my brain could light on fire until she showed me. She built my confidence until she no longer had to do so. In that way, she got me to “step into my power, to feel it, exercise it, use it.” She was great at that, and as a newbie Dom, that could be considered part of my training.
The other thing she taught me (and this took longer to sink in) was that as the Dom, my only concern should be about not causing actual harm. Otherwise, it shouldn’t matter to me that the sub didn’t like doing this or that, or having this or that done to her. Accepting the Dom’s command and control was in her nature if she was a true sub, and I needed to stop worrying about it and just ask for what I wanted. I’m fine with that, but I also enjoy being able to coax cooperation on some things that don’t come naturally to some subs.
I need to pause here and point out that there about 100 different kinds of subs, just as there are 100 different kinds of Doms. A masochistic sub who is heavily into subjugation, humiliation, objectification, and degradation is a fantastic find treated differently than a soft, submissive girl who wants to feel dominated and controlled, yet safe and warm & fuzzy. Both seem happy to drop into subspace when being controlled, and I’m please to oblige. But the masochist is more fun.
the sub:
As someone who has done quite a bit of Topping lately, I am in total agreement that there is no greater fun to be had than torturing a masochist!
I do love how you describe your first submissive building your confidence and helping you step into your power. But it sounds as if you are saying that one way you started feeling powerful was to stop being concerned about what the submissive liked. However, you also say, “A sub needs to ask for what she wants.” Is there a contradiction in that in your mind?
As you may remember from one of our previous conversations, I think whether a sub does or doesn’t like doing what she’s told matters very much, not so much in a single instance, but in the long-term. If the sub is constantly being used in ways that do not serve him or her on a deeper level — or that makes him or her feel an inner recoil — isn’t there a danger she (or he) eventually becomes dissatisfied and unfulfilled? Or is it your opinion that a true submissive will automatically feel served and be fulfilled doing whatever pleases the Dom, no matter what it is?
I have not found that to be the case for me, I emptied myself pleasing Doms who believed “it didn’t matter” whether I liked doing “doing this or that,” and while I had little problem in the short-term, over the course of a year I became miserable and wanted to run screaming from the relationship even though I felt very emotionally committed to it. So would it follow I am not truly submissive? Because I do wonder sometimes!
Of course, a D/s relationship by definition is oriented toward what the Dom wants, I’m just saying the sub’s likes and dislikes matter, too. One of the hardest things for a submissive is figuring out when to just shut up and do what she’s told, and when to speak up about what might not work for her. We definitely internalize the message “it shouldn’t matter” whether we like something or not, and to speak up feels like we might be trying to top from the bottom, or being a “brat” (which I know you don’t like). Too often we don’t speak, to the detriment of the D/s relationship, in my opinion. Hence, my thoughts on “training” a Dom in understanding how best to use her likes and dislikes in gaining control of her. I think an old saying applies here: “You can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.”
the Dom:
“The sub needs to ask for what she wants” means they need to say “Please, could you ease up a bit on the cane until I get more acclimated?” Or, “I’d like more aftercare.” Or, “Please consider that I don’t seem to react well to having my labia being pulled until they’re the size of the mainsail on a schooner.”
Sure, I can appease a sub with honey, but for the most part I don’t want to. Appeasement weakens most D/s relationships until they break. Just NO.
D/s is not about the Dom creating an egalitarian relationship. The sub relinquishes power to the Dom by definition. A D/s relationship cannot be undertaken like a conventional relationship where there is usually an undertone of a struggle for power. What is the point of that? Sort this shit out at the beginning, both get to decide if it’s worth moving forward, and then you commit or you don’t.
And yes, I believe that the sub’s ultimate satisfaction derives (should derive) from pleasing their Dom, whatever it is He wants. That’s what power exchange is. If the Dom is trying to please the sub’s whims, if there are items to ‘negotiate’ on an ongoing basis, the relationship is not even ‘D/s Adjacent’.
There are Doms who consider being The Domliest Dom In All The Land to be their Prime Directive, and order their sub around about every little thing. These Doms typically also try to Dom the waitress, the barista, the bank teller, and their mom. That’s not my style. I try to keep things somewhat relaxed.
While we are engaged in BDSM play, my sub understands that the protocol is I SAY IT, YOU DO IT. And that when out in public, there is a difference between the behavior I expect from her when among other kinky people in a dungeon or even at a munch vs. being among vanilla civilians.
Once we’re taking a break from play, and there’s pillow talk and some affection and some aftercare and joking around, things get more informal to some extent. Making the sub laugh is an excellent way to gain her confidence and trust, not as a ploy, but because that’s what I do and I’m good at it. I enjoy making people laugh. I don’t want to be on guard all the time for disobedience. BDSM is fun for me, and constant vigilance is just annoying.
One of the nicer compliments I’ve gotten was about my skill at repeatedly softly segueing back into (sometimes intense) play after breaks. I thought all Doms could do that, but apparently, it’s not so common. I wasn’t taught that — it just happened organically. And then there was the time this adorable sub looked up and said “God, your cock smells delicious!”
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